I've been suffering some pretty dull pains in my right hand for the past four days -- the worst I've had in years -- and I was thinking about picking one up.
A little background: when I tweeted about my wrist pains this morning (twitter.com/ryan/status/15791380806 ), I got a TON of responses from people telling me that a Magic Mouse would actually make things worse. I can definitely believe it, but I might also be a bit unusual in that I've always found my body responds best to thin and flat input devices. The thinner and flatter the better.
Wrist "protectors" and Apple's old super tall keyboard (gdgt.com/apple/keyboard/ ) are super uncomfortable; I've typed on a Logitech diNovo (gdgt.com/logitech/dinovo/ ) practically as long as they've been around. So my thinking was that I should try using the thinnest non-portable mouse I could find, and right now I think that title goes to the Magic Mouse.
So how have your experiences been? Are there any other more ergonomic, flat mice I should be looking at?
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What do you think of the Magic Mouse's ergonomics? How's it been on your wrist?
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ryan's pick
If you really consider your hand to prefer flat mice, then you might as well give the Magic Mouse a try. For me, I can't imagine a less ergonomic mouse in existence. Perhaps this pain is something telling you that you don't actually work better with flat mice? :)
Personally, I prefer the good 'ol RF Logitech mice. I fear the day my beloved MX1000 dies, as I think my hand has molded to it.
Question, Ryan: I seem to recall that you and/or Peter are lefties. That might not be an issue if we're talking about flat mice, but if anyone here were to suggest non-flat mice, that would be an issue.
In the end, though, I have a different suggestion. I've gotten the pains you're describing several times. Each time it never really feels like I'm doing anything differently while at my computer, but I still get these pains. You know what fixes it every time? Taking a break from the computer. I know, it's a crappy suggestion, but it works!
ps- does it seem like Apple is forgoing ergonomics lately? First the Magic Mouse, then the iPad, and now nobody seems to be questioning how easy it will be to hold up an iPhone for FaceTime... I know Apple makes cool stuff, but shouldn't this be a concern?
Personally, I prefer the good 'ol RF Logitech mice. I fear the day my beloved MX1000 dies, as I think my hand has molded to it.
Question, Ryan: I seem to recall that you and/or Peter are lefties. That might not be an issue if we're talking about flat mice, but if anyone here were to suggest non-flat mice, that would be an issue.
In the end, though, I have a different suggestion. I've gotten the pains you're describing several times. Each time it never really feels like I'm doing anything differently while at my computer, but I still get these pains. You know what fixes it every time? Taking a break from the computer. I know, it's a crappy suggestion, but it works!
ps- does it seem like Apple is forgoing ergonomics lately? First the Magic Mouse, then the iPad, and now nobody seems to be questioning how easy it will be to hold up an iPhone for FaceTime... I know Apple makes cool stuff, but shouldn't this be a concern?
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ryan's pick
I thought it would be terrible ergonomically, but having used one for near six months, I've had zero problems with it. Surprisingly, it feels natural now.
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You can take a look at the 3M Ergonomic Mouse, it's quite nice, though not perfect and can help by relieving the stress on your wrist.
bloguedegeek.net/2009/10/21/souris-ergonomique-opt...
bloguedegeek.net/2009/10/21/souris-ergonomique-opt...
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Have you considered an ergonomic keyboard as well? I can't see how you guys type for any length of time on a straight keyboard. the curve makes a world of difference on wrist strain.
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Guys,
I'm designer and would say that wrist pain due ergonomic issues is more complex that just say this mouse is better than that. It depends on the size and weight of your hand, the length of your fingers; it also has to do with your seat and desk. It does not worth it buying a 200 bucks ergonomic mouse if it does not fit your hand, or your seat or desk is not properly set.
There're lots of workplace ergonomics articles out there on the web. Consider reading some of them and talk to your phisicist or phisioterapist.
Kindly,
Lincoln
I'm designer and would say that wrist pain due ergonomic issues is more complex that just say this mouse is better than that. It depends on the size and weight of your hand, the length of your fingers; it also has to do with your seat and desk. It does not worth it buying a 200 bucks ergonomic mouse if it does not fit your hand, or your seat or desk is not properly set.
There're lots of workplace ergonomics articles out there on the web. Consider reading some of them and talk to your phisicist or phisioterapist.
Kindly,
Lincoln
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I haven't had any comfort issues using my Magic Mouse. Yeah, it's flatter than a normal mouse, but I don't hold my hand flat against it. The heel of my palm rests on the bottom edge of the mouse and my hand arcs over it touching down again at my fingertips. That way I can maneuver my whole hand to use gestures on the entire top surface (thanks to BetterTouchTool).
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the logitech vx nano has been my main mouse for years. i've never encountered problems with it, and it is small, but doesn't strain my hand at all. gdgt.com/logitech/vx/nano/
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While it's undoubtedly one of the slickest mouses around, I'm partial to having a real middle mouse button (even if it's a scroll wheel) particularly for working in Maya and some other 3D/drawing programs. I find the Razer mice to have the best scroll wheel/MM buttons out there, with a nice wide wheel and great feeling detents for control.
That being said, the number one reason I use a gaming mouse is not because I'm a big PC gamer (I'm not), it's because ergonomically it is more comfortable to only move my wrists a small amount to send the cursor flying to any point on the screen than to have to make large motions with my mouse/wrist. You just have to get used to the speed/sensitivity. I recommend turning mouse acceleration off if you have this sort of mouse.
Otherwise, I use a wacom tablet. Wacom also makes a few smaller tablets with not only pen input, but multi-touch as well. Haven't yet tried them myself...
That being said, the number one reason I use a gaming mouse is not because I'm a big PC gamer (I'm not), it's because ergonomically it is more comfortable to only move my wrists a small amount to send the cursor flying to any point on the screen than to have to make large motions with my mouse/wrist. You just have to get used to the speed/sensitivity. I recommend turning mouse acceleration off if you have this sort of mouse.
Otherwise, I use a wacom tablet. Wacom also makes a few smaller tablets with not only pen input, but multi-touch as well. Haven't yet tried them myself...
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I use it everyday, nothing wrong with it.
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try the Kensington Expert Trackball and consciously try to change your sitting position so that you hand and wrist are relaxed.
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Ryan, what mouse are you currently using?
I've had a bit of wrist pain with 'traditional' mice, but I switched to a Logitech Trackman Wheel, and I love it.
I've had a bit of wrist pain with 'traditional' mice, but I switched to a Logitech Trackman Wheel, and I love it.
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I've been using the microsoft natural 7000 gdgt.com/microsoft/natural/wireless-laser-mouse-70... for the past few years which has worked out quite well. I find that it's most comfortable for the palm of my hand to be as vertical as possible. I also use the Microsoft natural keyboard.
As much as I love Apple, they give absolutely no thought to ergonomics so I stick to Microsoft for my input devices
As much as I love Apple, they give absolutely no thought to ergonomics so I stick to Microsoft for my input devices
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I tried using mine for a while, and it was an ergonomic nightmare. That said, I'm not a mouse guy. I'd really prefer a "magic touchpad" as was rumoured to be announced at the WWDC keynote, but barring that, I've found a few acceptable solutions:
- Wacom bamboo touch. Can respond to finger touch, has multi-touch (just 2 I think) The 2-finger stuff requires the mac software to be installed, and it's not quite as responsive feeling as a built-in Apple touchpad
- Kensington SlimBlade trackball. Love it. It's very thin for a trackball, and obviously requires very minimal wrist movement. I love the scrolling functionality (just spin the trackball as if it were a jog dial). What I don't like is that the scrolling paradigm excludes 2-dimensional scrolling. You can hit a button to put the trackball into a mode where you use it to pan around, which works OK.
- ThinkPad keyboard --hear me out on this one. It's very thin, has a high quality thinkpad keyboard feel (it's basically the T410 keyboard in an external case). The trackpoint is typical ThinkPad genius, that is if you like the trackpoint. 2-dimensional scrolling is possible, and best yet your hands never leave the keyboard. Plus it's the cheapest solution of the three.. it's half the price of the Wacom and the SlimBlade.
- Wacom bamboo touch. Can respond to finger touch, has multi-touch (just 2 I think) The 2-finger stuff requires the mac software to be installed, and it's not quite as responsive feeling as a built-in Apple touchpad
- Kensington SlimBlade trackball. Love it. It's very thin for a trackball, and obviously requires very minimal wrist movement. I love the scrolling functionality (just spin the trackball as if it were a jog dial). What I don't like is that the scrolling paradigm excludes 2-dimensional scrolling. You can hit a button to put the trackball into a mode where you use it to pan around, which works OK.
- ThinkPad keyboard --hear me out on this one. It's very thin, has a high quality thinkpad keyboard feel (it's basically the T410 keyboard in an external case). The trackpoint is typical ThinkPad genius, that is if you like the trackpoint. 2-dimensional scrolling is possible, and best yet your hands never leave the keyboard. Plus it's the cheapest solution of the three.. it's half the price of the Wacom and the SlimBlade.
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The low height felt a little unusual at first, but it's been great for me. I hold it lightly, only my fingers are touching it—you're definitely not meant to rest your palm on it. The lack of separate buttons means you can do a normal click with your whole hand (even if you have the right click enabled) which feels easier on my hand than using one finger to click over and over.
Scrolling is really fantastic too. Swiping with two fingers to the side is a little awkward, but not too bad. I use Jitouch to add three finger swipe up (for show desktop) and down (for Exposé) which works out really well.
Scrolling is really fantastic too. Swiping with two fingers to the side is a little awkward, but not too bad. I use Jitouch to add three finger swipe up (for show desktop) and down (for Exposé) which works out really well.
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i have similar issues, i use the Arc mouse right now and am finding it's too tall, i keep going back to my lower profile logitech notebook mouse(it just chews thru batteries like crazy though), but keep thinking about the magic mouse too. i've only played with the magic mouse, not used it any amount of time to really judge, looking forward to responses
i use a wacom tablet for most of my "work" computing on my desktop and i know some people hate trackpads, but i LOVE them, i want that apple magic trackpad to be real and out now! my ideal set up would be a wacom tablet and a desktop trackpad, really.
i use a wacom tablet for most of my "work" computing on my desktop and i know some people hate trackpads, but i LOVE them, i want that apple magic trackpad to be real and out now! my ideal set up would be a wacom tablet and a desktop trackpad, really.
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The magic mouse is not very ergonomic compared to Logitech or Microsoft mice in the comparable price range. It is a nice mouse though.
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try a gel wristpad in front of your mouse and maybe one in front of your keyboard....i was in the same boat a few years ago and these stopped my wrist pain after just a few days of use...I use the belkin waverest...
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I've found the magic mouse to be too awkward to get used to. It could be because a few months ago I made the switch to the Microsoft Arc. The Arc feels way more ergonomic to me, I just hate the position of the back button. Comparison: yfrog.com/0pilhpj
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The Magic Mouse feels good to track around with, but the gestures can cause some strain. Using the gestures forces you to either lift up your hand and move it back, or contort your fingers to make it work. I don't think it's that much of a sacrifice, but if you're having wrist problems you may want to consider something else.
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and if all else fails get this fix for the ergonomics mmfixed.com/ ..it's been on engadget, techcrunch, etc. check it out
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