gdgt

I genuinely think iTunes is terrible, and according to my good friend who works as a programmer at Apple, so does everyone else there besides the iTunes team. That said, the Zune software is not that much better and it's not that much more lightweight either.

LeTueur, I'm not sure what your issue is with the reporter/Apple relationship. It is the same as with other companies for the most part. People just get a little more into Apple products typically.

iTunes is for getting things done. Zune is a very visual representation for music discovery.

I actually agree with this totally. although there are views you can use in Zune that let you "get things done." Also, I prefer the Zune options for setting up a music folder and it's constant crawling of that location for new music.

ITunes actually is the opposite for me. It's actually is slow, especially while backing up, to the point of me not being able to get much done. To be honest, I really like the Zune software and its integration with their media services and it has come a long way since its early days. On the other hand, iTunes is dropping the ball, it's bloated to no end and just eats up all my computer's RAM.

There isn't one media player that's knocked it out of the park yet, that's why I live on streaming music services now, like Napster.

iTunes is still the best option if you have a great deal of music in your library and use an iPod

I think it's better phrased as being the only viable option, for syncing that is. There are third party solutions to syncing music with your iPod, but then you'll having to worry about Apple breaking it in an update.

yeah with with the iPod and iPhone being two of the most popular devices out there, iTunes is consequently one of the most popular music managing programs

Yes, I agree. Sometimes it feels that the iPod-iTunes tether goes beyond my iPod... all the way up to my neck. While iTunes does provide the best relationship between you and your iPod, I'm not sure it provides the best relationship between you and your media. Wouldn't you agree?

I definitely agree, iTunes is far from the best media organizer/manager, especially with larger libraries of music. I think we can all agree there is still room for companies to make a compelling product.

Wouldn't winamp work too? There's another one called SharePod, which I use every now and then. I know iTunes is the best one for transferring music to an iPod, but as far as music media organizer? I'm not convinced. It seems bloated to me.

"I know iTunes is the best one for transferring music to an iPod, but as far as music media organizer? I'm not convinced. It seems bloated to me."

I actually like how it handles organizing music. But it's just completely inefficient to do so. It's like booting up a VM and starting to run a new OS in the background. The performance is completely unacceptable.

Can you image if Google decided to make a music / media organization and syncing tool, how fast it would be?

Holly Crap! That would actually work if it was de-centralized. I feel that that's where Google is going with the Google TV. I would love to pay for a song/movie in Google Checkout and be able to access the song anywhere without having to download it. So if I buy a song, I could access it through Pandora or Rhapsody or Napster, etc. Oh, wait, that wont happen any time soon cus' the music industry is 30 years in the past as far as content distribution goes, amongst other things.

The only thing that bothers me about iTunes organizing media is that stupid compilations folder. Seriously annoying. I turn it off yet somehow things still end up in there.

media managing (for an iPod) not organizing

I like Amie Street, personally. By the way, your picture here is very... intense.

Gadgets bring the intensity out of me.

I've heard good things about Amie Street, never used it myself though.

and with that response, I shall follow you!

I don't follow. I have my Zune library connected to my Xbox 360, so that I can stream all my media over my network. I can't get that done with iTunes. I also have access to my Zune account through my 360 so I can purchase shows and music with either Zune Points or Microsoft Points. I can't do either of those things with iTunes. How is it then that iTunes gets "things done"?

okay think of iTunes like a spreadsheet and think of Zune like the iTunes music visualizer. and the reason you can hook up your zune library to your 360 is because they are both part of Microsoft's ecosystem. iTunes is hooked up into the app store i guess for games

Zune software is still a bit hefty, yes.

Well, in my experience, Zune software is a lot better, it opens up to other platforms, such as my 360. I hate Media Center, so i don't bother with it, but the Zune software + Xbox 360 works great. And in my comment about reporters, I heard a joke from a "tech analyst" (whatever that is) about how he met a guy in a tech convention. When he asked the guy what he did, he said "I'm a Tech Journalist". "Oh", replied the analyst, "so you work for Apple Marketing?". He didn't like that.

why am I being down-voted? On my own thread for pete's sake! Didn't know I was breaking anyone's heart. Just to let you all know, I'm talking here as a matter of opinion, not a matter of fact. Wow, tough crowd tonight...

As a matter of idle interest, how long does iTunes take to start up on your machines in order to complain about bloat on a regular basis?

The slowest Mac I have which I use iTunes on a regular basis on (highest-spec mid-09 17-inch unibody with an OCZ Vertex) takes about 3.5 seconds to launch iTunes (~20,000 tracks and lots of video) in OS X, and about 3.8 seconds for 64-bit iTunes in W7 Ultimate 64.

Every other machine I which I use iTunes regularly on launches in about the same time, or faster. Obviously being on SSD's throughout helps, but I was wondering how big the gulf is for people who complain it's slow.


Oh - and Brettdunnam, the Zune software is only 'not lightweight' in the sense that it makes far greater use of the GPU than iTunes, and it may be highlighting that your install may need to be dialled down in terms of graphics. Zune (with the same number of tracks as the above) loads in under 2.5 seconds on the same setup as the above.

MacBook Pro, 2.53Ghz Core 2 Duo, 4GB RAM -- 12 seconds to start with my "limited" library (2K songs). On my full library with around 20K songs, it takes about 20 seconds to load.

MacBook Pro 2.5 GHz Core 2 Duo, 4GB RAM - at least 10 to 12 seconds (on the OS X or Windows side, doesn't matter). Small library of material, maybe about 40GB total.

Acer Aspire Timeline 3410, 1.2GHz Celeron 723 (single core), 3GB RAM

10.6 seconds with 940MB of music, 7 podcasts and 6 iTunes U lecture courses.

For comparison, WMP take 1.5 seconds to load up with the same library.

When I start iTunes on Windows XP machines (Dell Latitude D610 Pentium M 2.0 GHz 1 GB RAM, PC 3.4 GHz P4 3 GB RAM) it takes about a minute to load and drags like molasses once it has on a MP3 collection of over 100 GBs.

iTunes = iCry

This current generation? On a Mac? No. There's nothing worthwhile apart from iTunes. Under Windows - plenty.

And I actually agree with LeTueur 100% in what he's getting at and what he is getting downvoted for from the Apple fans. I make a point of Disliking only really dumb comments, otherwise I'd redress the balance in your favour ;)

iTunes is severely cramping my ability to do what I want with my media outside the confines of single computer -> iPods scenario, and it's a limitation which is encountered less in a non-Apple scenario. I can't say I have speed issues or bloat with iTunes - I don't run old machines, and I don't own hard disks anymore on any of the machines I regularly sit down at (bar the L11 at least) - so even iTunes load takes seconds.

I do like that iTunes syncs playcounts, and honestly I have no huge issues with its basic usability. For me the bidirectional playcount syncing has become a critical feature and that's why my current real options are limited to Zune or iPod, although I do use other Mass Storage players.

But the demerits of the iTunes ecosystem is beginning to outweigh the benefits for me, as I do more and more stuff with the media I accumulate.

I really like the Zune software in terms of taking the core of what iTunes does, and doing it in a more efficient and interoperable way, although the 'whole package' might be missing - although it could be argued that due to Windows' superiority in terms of media consumption, you don't need a 'one-stop-shop' since other programs can play nice with Zune, and vice versa. I don't own a Zune so I can't experience the full 'workflow' but from what I've seen this is approaching my ideal PMP platform, so personally I can't wait for WinMo7 to come out with full Zune features over here.

j.River Media Center may look as though it belongs in the last century but it is a very solid, superior piece of software. It's my main choice for PC media management, and as Zune dynamically updates libraries, j.River can be used in conjunction with Zune.

Mediamonkey is also excellent now, and unlike j.River is free - and also kind of syncs with newer iPods/iPhone, although the feature is not as stable or usable as I'd like right now.

foobar is the choice of many in-depth geeks, but personally I steer away from it for usability reasons - but it is worth looking into if you can't afford j.River.

And of course there's always Media Center / WMP on Windows itself - the combo is far from sucky these days.

true on all counts,sir.

I really only use the Zune Software for syncing and the marketplace, but for a general player/organizer I'll use Media Monkey and Amarok (depending on what OS I'm using at the moment).

I used Media Monkey for a long long time, right up until some one broke into my house and stole my Zen Vision: M. I tried using it with my following media players (iPod & Zune), but it just never worked right. It seemed awkward in certain tasks. I should give it another shot, though, it's been a while.